Crazy Idea

KaspersMom · Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 12:55 am Post subject: Crazy Idea

So, since I live in rural America and it is difficult to find an obedience class in the area I have been considering sending Kasper to a month of obedience training at a prison. It would be beneficial for me to do the training with him, but I have seen dogs who have had positive results after being in the prison program. Also, I think the training is very rewarding for the inmates (I've seen shows on the subject on television). What are every ones thoughts on the idea? Am I crazy? Does it sound beneficial? He isn't like a wild banshee or anything. He knows how to sit, lay down, etc, but he lacks in recall and just general listening. He also is a jumper at times. Tonight he might have just been a little excited to see me but he jumped up and his head hit the side of my face so hard I thought he broke my eardrum. Granted I am only 4'10" so I'm sure you can imagine us together. I am not at my wits end with him or anything. I love this dog to death, but he could be a little more obedient. He is only a yr and 4 months old and yes he gets plenty of exercise...we put in a total of 3 miles a day! Thank you for your input.

weimdawgs · Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 4:21 am Post subject:

I certainly don't think it is a bad idea. I've seen those shows too.

I don't know if I could be away from my dog for a month though Crying or Very sad

weimdogmom · Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 7:45 am Post subject:

I don't think it's a bad idea, either -- but I agree about not being able to be away from either Jazz or Mayu for that long.

It sounds like you're doing a great job with Kasper already and there are just a few things that need more work. What about some books on positive training? Ones by Jean Donaldson, Pat Miller, Karen Pryor and Ian Dunbar (I think) would be interesting and helpful.

simis · Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 12:13 pm Post subject:

Just to play devils advocate - can't that kind of break the more sensitive dogs - especially weimys as they are so addicted to their people?

peppernaei · Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 4:16 pm Post subject:

I think it is a great idea as long as the program is reputable and you'll get guidance once he comes back to you. Training isn't a one step process.

AmazingGrayce · Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 5:09 pm Post subject:

Ive seen things about those programs too and they look pretty cool and beneficial.

The questions I would be asking are:
How are the inmates chosen for the program? Good behavior?
Do they allow any prisoner in the program or only those who have comitted non-violent crimes(drugs, robbery, etc)? I WOULD NOT want my dog w/ anyone whos been incarcerated for a violent crime bc that would just scare me..what if they snapped?
What types of precautions are taken to protect the animals?
Where are they housed?

Im with Lynn I dont know if I could stand Grace being away for a month LOL...Id go through some serious SA although Im sure it would be good for her haha. My biggest concerns would be its a reputable program and that Im would not want my dog to be with someone who has a history of violence..even if they have been on the best of behavior while incarcerated.

simis · Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 9:20 pm Post subject:

How long would your weim be sent away for? For some reason I have it in my mind as like a 30 day program. I could be totally off - if it's a weeklong program that would be a lot more appropriate IMO.

I completly agree with you Peppernaei that pups should learn time to be away - but say for an example, anything over 10-14 days seems a bit too much like more than "tough love" to me. Embarassed

I guess if I did that for my pup I'd want to visit and that would violate the very thing you are trying to accomplish. I think I would try an animal specialist who teaches positive training methods first. If that didn't work I'd look into learning an e-collar method for recall and if that didn't work, then I'd ship them off as a last resort. To me half the battle is getting your dog to listen to YOU, not to have strangers who they won't see again teach them. Seems to me that when you get your pup back home they would relapse and if the person/ppl with them are not stern enforcers, the bad manners would slide back in.

I can tell you from the other perspective that if I were in prison I sure would love to have a weim come in that I could spend time with!!

Wrench · Posted: Sun Jun 29, 2008 10:34 am Post subject:

Just don't let him get any prison tattoo's!=)

anne · Posted: Sun Jun 29, 2008 9:51 pm Post subject:

I encourage all my puppy people to send their dogs away for a short period when they are young (6 mos or so) for the reasons peppernai mentions, to "practice" for the future. Most people also want to go on vacation sometimes and it helps for a dog to get used to it, instead of it being a traumatic experience when the dog is older and has never been left alone before.

I am in the process of selling my house right now and my dogs have had to be boarded all over the place, with friends, in the car at work (weather in consideration of course) etc. It is SUCH a relief to know that at any given moment my dogs can do something outside the norm and they won't freak over it.

All that said, sending a dog to a trainer means making sure you know what they do, how they do it, and that you are on board with their methods and most of all are comfortable with who you entrust your dog to.

Also very important... just because a dog listens to a trainer doesn't mean that that dog is trained with YOU. Again, as peppernai so aptly said, it's not a one step process.

Wrench · Posted: Mon Jun 30, 2008 11:56 am Post subject:

As Anne said in the last line there ...our neighbor sent her dog off to be trained and spent a ton of money for really good training...he got home and is more of an idiot ( I say this with love=) than before because SHE does not handle him properly, with the Alpha way , with authority, etc and so basically it was a waste of money and she still has a badly mannered dog.

One thing i love about watching Cesar ( I am a watcher yes=) is he ends up training the humans more than the dogs!

Last evening on a walk Michael and I passed and chatted with a guy about Wrench and Weims and the guy said how they had two weims before that where " both retarded" .....we both walked away thinking " more likely it was the owners, not the dog". When ever Wrench acts up in a way we don't like our first response is to check our own selves and correct ourselves before we can correct him.

KaspersMom · Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 10:36 pm Post subject:

Thanks for all the input. I too do not know how I would handle him being gone for a month. I think he'd been fine. He gets excited when I take him to the boarding house for the weekend when I have to go out of town and he can't come. I'd have to keep very busy. I about couldn't stand being gone from him for 5 days. We'd have to work up to a month...LOL I was looking at the program with the Colorado Department of Corrections and there is a prison a little over an hour from where I live in Kansas into Colorado. I do have experience with a dog that came out of the prison there. He was a therapy dog at the nursing home where I worked. He was great, but then again every dog is different. I do watch Caesar and well am reading his book "How to be the pack leader" and I just bought the other one...can't think of the name right off hand. He's far from being the "devil dog" or anything.