Naughty Luna!!

LunaBrown · Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2008 8:34 pm Post subject: Naughty Luna!!

Lately she has been getting more and more competitive with toys... and tonight we finally had a scuffle Sad

Everyone is okay, and I'm kind of glad for Gunther for finally standing up for himself... Given their interactions the past few days, even though I didn't see the fight I am guessing she either got nasty about a toy, or tried to take one from him.

But now what?! Dogs are having a time out in their crates right now and the toy in question is actually in the trash. We have been taking them away and hiding them when she gets icky about them, but she just picks another toy!

But what can we do to work with Luna on this? I can't have her being an awful little wench about her toys every time there is another dog in the house, and soon enough there will be a second dog that is NOT leaving!

She is 17 months old, spayed... She hasn't shown any food aggression, just TOYS (and sticks of course, which qualify as toys when you are a weim...)

Confused

massweimy · Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 1:05 am Post subject: Let them work it out

Sounds like they are just establishing rank very normal and healthy with dogs. As it was her house she is the dog alpha you can back her up and pay a little bit more attention to her. Feed her first and keep some cold water handy to break up any big fights.Try and make a loud noise clap, noise can, stern no etc do not start yelling allot this fuels it like your barking if you are male it usually works a little better (it''s science not sexism) (Dogs take praise better from women due to our vocal frequencies and discipline better from men) . I know they look like fierce fights but the usually aren't. When you walk them either walk them at about the same pace or let your girl go a little ahead of him not you though.You want to be sure you and your family stay supreme alpha to them because the pack dynamic is changing and little kids sometimes get to become lower ranked in their eyes.

Also there is no need to toss the toy just take it say mine firmly and hide it some where high and distract them with a game instead of crating them as a punishment. If one dogs stay rude that is the one you need to teach manners if it goes on for longer then a week or so. Also avoid tug of war games with them and try and get them working together walks are the best here.

Also pay attention to their body language shackles up all the way to the tail, Tail standing straight up, ears forward, Time to clap and distract. I will post to this with a link that show's dog body language.
Oh also let her crate be a little closer to her people as well.

If you have a yard let them work it out there even if gunther wins alpha rank it will still be fine I find if you prop a dog up in alpha role and they don't deserve it in the dogs eyes it can make the fights last forever.

Hope this helps,

h20fwlkillr · Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 1:26 am Post subject:

massweimy · Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 1:33 am Post subject: Agreed

I agree I meant things like where the crate is don't over praise the new dog over luna treat them the same via praise eating first is eating first and while this does send some signals it also keeps it the way it was before her routine /terroritory was disrupted by her new buddy most trainers do this including Ian Dunbar and Victoria Stillwell.

anne · Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 1:55 pm Post subject:

What's mine is mine; what's yours is mine -- that's a bitch for ya. I really don't think it necessarily means she's pulling rank. (Riley is top dog in my house, but he lets the underlings take his toys or whatever.)

LunaBrown · Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 8:51 pm Post subject:

Soooo being as she is a female, that is just what I get?!

I worry because she is such an agressive dog... not mean aggressive but she is always in-your-face trying to pester and play with ANY dog she meets. Most of the time it is just because she is so excited and wants to play... but I have to wonder if there is something 'missing' because she was seperated from her mom and siblings at 6.5 weeks...

Is there ANYTHING I can do to help teach her to play a little nicer?

PS- I took the toy in question and threw it away becuase it was at the end of it's life span anyhow...

poisonivvy · Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 10:02 pm Post subject:

So our Elsa is a grade A dominant female as well.

What we had to do was re-establish our human position in the pack. Mom and Dad OWN all the toys. It does not belong to any of the dogs. If Mom or Dad wants the toy, Elsa or Ben have to give and drop immediately.

Slowly her behavior started to improve, because she was not allowed to resource guard or claim anything. Everything is Mom and Dad's. If she cannot be a good girl and change her behavior, all toys are picked up immediately after playtime.

For small scrabbles, a nice shot of water from a water gun or sprayer breaks up things quickly if you don't have a strong shouting voice.

It's taken about 8 months since we got Ben, and realizing that we had to change before Elsa's behavior changes.

And then again...dogs don't understand the concept of sharing. So we always have the 'yoink' moments (what you have is better than mine). Once gets up to get water, the other steals whatever the desired object is.[/b]

versatilek9s · Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 6:28 am Post subject:

anne · Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 2:15 pm Post subject:

Yeah Riley would let every puppy we've had in the house bite his legs, bite his ears, crawl on him, and all he'd do is move away, or just let them bite him, but you bet when one goes past the line, he asserts himself. But that situation very rarely happens as all the dogs seem to know what the line is and as they grow a bit older they all leave him alone.

And no I don't think it's just a female thing but I do think that females tend to be a less laid back as a generalization.

Also you may be onto something there about her being removed from the litter early. You shoulda seen Indy with her pups from about 6 weeks, they looked at her cross eyed and she was correcting them. This lasted for some time and right around when they about a year old, she started allowing things she NEVER would have put up with before (such as accidentally slamming into her when they were playing).

Pinchc44 · Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 2:44 pm Post subject:

We have some of the same issues with our girl Sade. She can get a little pushy from time to time with our older GSP. She is lucky as he lets her be the Alpha and is very submissive with her. In fact, she is down right bratty at times so we have to remind her that we are the leaders and not her.

Anne, how is Riley?

anne · Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 1:44 am Post subject:

Riley isn't submissive, he just puts up with a lot. So much so that sometimes we would wish that he'd so something about the brats. If he did do anything it would be a LOOK or maybe a small growl, and that was all it took. I let him work it out, but the one thing I did inforce was the rule that when Riley went to his crate, others were not allowed to follow him in there to bug him.

Here is a photo of Pixy as a little puppy tormenting Riley and Riley just taking it. Not a great picture but Riley's expression cracks me up, poor dog.

versatilek9s · Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 5:59 am Post subject:

That's Maya for you, too! What a great picture! Good benevolent doggie leaders make a multiple dog household a million times easier.

CherrystoneWeims · Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 10:10 am Post subject:

Anne,

That sounds like Pearl with the pups. They are now 6 weeks old and she is herding them around. She gets downright rough with them! If one moves out of line that pup will get rolled. It's like she is the "fun police"!

Ethan is very tolerant of the puppies. He will lay down and let them crawl all over him and bite him. He does let them know when enough is enough. He'll give them this fake growl with a combination of a bark. He also will push them away gently.

anne · Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 1:29 pm Post subject:

The fun police -- LOL, that's a great description.